It's About The Horse

Blue Flame

After an incident today, and looking back on incidents in the past, I was thinking that a very important part of being a horseman is setting things up in a way that minimizes the danger to horses and humans when things go wrong.

We all make mistakes and sometimes our horses do unexpected things that have the potential to end very badly. Occasionally horses will burst into a full blown panic and the way we set things up before it happens can make a difference to the outcome.

I'm wondering if this topic could be a section on it's own or a sticky in a section. Here's an example below of what happened to us today that might go into this section.

I've always had concerns about horses running off with long, strong ropes attached to them. I've also been concerned about horses panicking when they get tangled up in these ropes.

Today we did some driving on one rein with the 45' as part of prep before riding. It went well so we looped the 45' around and tied the end through the ring. THe horse was sent out on a circle to the left with the far side rein over the back. When it was time, the far side rein was flicked off the back with the intent the horse would continue to circle with that rein over the hocks. It was something we've done plenty of and not had any trouble before.

Well, one way or another, that far side rein ended up looped around the off hind cannon and Blue Flame panicked and ran off with the rope still attached to his halter and wrapped around his hind leg - with the rest of the loop trailing out behing him. He got into a gallop before the 8kg tie, that I use to attach the 45' ring to the halter, broke and the rope fell to the ground and he was free of it.

I'm so glad I always use that cable tie in case of such a situation (actually, it also stops the human from putting too much pressure on the horse as well, worked very well for getting human much lighter on the rope) but since the end of the rope was solidly tied to the ring, it was still a very solid loop. Point being that if the trailing end of that loop had caught something solid, even though the cable tie seperated the ring from the halter, the front of the loop falling away from the halter would catch the horse by the chest or front legs.

I'm thinking that from now on I'll either tie a loop on the end of the 45' or attach another ring to it. Then I can have both ends attached to the halter using one or two cable ties and if the worst should happen the 45' loop will break open at the front and not trip the horse.

So that's my example from today. We got away with it, partly by planning and partly by good luck, this time but the savvy thing is to learn from such things and adjust what we do.

I'd like to hear and learn from y'all how you set things up in case things don't go the way you planned. Also, if you witnessed a situation that ended up putting the horse or human in danger, would you please share? Even if you haven't thought of a way to make the situation safer, it could highlight to the rest of us some of the unexpected things that COULD happen.

Bear in mind I'm not asking for the prior and proper preparation stuff to prevent these situations occuring - because sometimes they occur anyway and it's almost never what you'd expect when they do.

No, what I'm looking for are the ways to set up the safety nets and the ambulances at the bottom of the cliff - the things that automatically turn an unsafe situation into a less unsafe one when all else fails.

Perhaps we could think of it in terms of things we teach our horses, outlining how these things might go wrong, then working out how to minimise the damage if they do.

Example - Flank Roping.
What can go wrong?
Is there a safer way to set this up so that if it does go wrong, the damage is minimised?

What views do people have on breakaway tack, such as using cable ties versus using solid tack?
Are there certain situations where either solid or breakaway is preferred? What are those situations and why?

I think if we can save just one horse from a nasty injury or worse, then this is a thread worth persuing. An added benefit would be that some of those scary things might not be so scary for people if they can see a way to minimise the risks beyond taking the "don't go there" path (flank roping comes to mind again here).

There must be thousands of years of experience on this forum and though none of us has seen it all, we can certainly see more through eachothers eyes.

Leah · Member Joined: 02 Feb 2009 Posts: 1476

Using Blocker Tie Rings to tie horses.

YES they should be able to handle being tied BUT those Blocker Rings teach them to tie and give them an out if they panic.

They have been a life saver.

Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:41 pm Post subject:

THat's a good one Leah, we usually just loop the rope over the rail and then around itself once or twice for some resistance. Sometimes we might rap the rail with one or two turns for the same reasons - but I've often looked and thought that both those methods could easily lock up on themselves if the horse pulled a certain way.

You know, most people around here tie up to a piece of bailing twine with the idea being that if the horse really panicks they'll break free - even the riding school crossties have the dog clips attached with twine. Some believe it's safer for the horse, while others say it teaches them they can get free if they pull back.

I think a controlled resistance like the blocker is a nice compromise. I'd rather be retraining a horse to tie than dealing with/retraining an injured one that had a traumatic experience while tied up.

Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:43 pm Post subject:

Anyone ever had a rope catch on a jump/log while sending the horse over it?

PasoBaby_CarolU · Site Admin Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 9015

I agree, I made this a sticky.

I've had my rope catch in the gap of the door while trying to trailer load from the fender.

Watch ropes, especially the 45', that it doesn't loop and you step in it accidentally. One of the early lessons I teach young horses is to not be afraid while they drag things. After all, the next thing they drag could be me, and I'd prefer they not panic and drag me to death.

On the subject of tying, horses have to learn to be tied in and to the trailer.

Be careful that the halter is ALWAYS tied up into the throat latch. I've had more then one horse get the knot under their chin and in their mouth. Some panic when this happens.
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Hosslass · Member Joined: 25 Feb 2009 Posts: 95

How about when riding, keep your cell phone on your person, not carried on the saddle. So if you and the horse part the cell is on you and not down the trail with your horse.

Also, be sure your horse is ok with ring tones on the ground and above them as while you're in the saddle.

Happyappy98 · Member Joined: 04 Feb 2009 Posts: 270 Location: Illinois

Blue this is awesome! Great idea.

I taught Jiggies early on to walk around the arena with his LR on this way if he steps on it and freaks he learns to move off. He is now 11 and still occationally freaks! But he has learned to move off quite quickly and he is fine. Just moseys away.
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Pyrgirl · Member Joined: 07 Feb 2009 Posts: 1308

Yes, here is one that happened to us recently.

I use portable electric fencing during the summer so that my horses can get at least some grazing on fresh grass in. they respect the electricity beautifully. I have never had a problem.

Last week I took them out to graze. Thankfully I had the power turned off.
I opened the fence and laid a section of netting on the ground. On the way into the area, one of my minis got a foot caught in the netting. I did have her by the lead rope (thankfully.) She panicked a bit and tried to kick the net off. That just proceeded to get her more tangled up. I was trying to get her to stand still. She could have torn the entire fence down and dragged it off into the woods. As she moved she began getting the fence tangled around my feet as well. It could have been a MAJOR catastrophe. She has had some training with ropes around her legs so she finally stood still. I did make one wise decision and untangled MY feet first. Then got her untangled and both of us went back to the paddock literally shaking.

This is what I learned. Don't let any netting lie on the ground. Do MORE rope training around the legs. I also need to keep the electricity turned on more often rather than going weeks at a time. The horses become too brave or non-chalant about the fencing. They need to actively be avoiding stepping on or going near the fencing/netting.

If anyone else has ideas, we'd certainly appreciate those, too.

BTW, after the incident I gave her a massage. At the end of that we were both so calm that she fell asleep breathing in my face. One of the worst possible catastrophes ended up in a most memorable moment for both of us. It was cool.

Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:10 pm Post subject:

Carol that halter one is a goody. I haven't seen the knot get in the mouth but I've seen it come close now that I think about it. I usually like to have the halter set high on the nose in any case. If you look at a picture of a horse's skull it's obvious why.

We don't want this . . .

To become this . . .

Sensitive feet - reducing risk of getting kicked when cleaning feet out.

Picking out feet is another area we could look at. Sometimes there is a risk of getting kicked - whether it be that horse's nature or there be an issue with pain like if a horse has bad thrush/fungus in the central cleft that needs to be cleaned out. If there is a risk of getting kicked while picking out feet, I find it safer to do it from the opposite side of the horse - less chance of getting hurt from there.

Treating leg injuries - reducing risk of getting kicked when treating.

Another one with treating injured legs is sometimes you just want the horse to keep that leg still but they might tend to keep lifting it if they are sensitive about it. It is tempting to try to just get it done with the leg in the air, but that position is already set up for the kick which might occur especially if the treatment might inflict a little pain or sting.

In this situation, it might be helpful to weight the leg you are treating by having someone else pick up the other foot. As long as the other person is not at risk of being kicked, this will buy you extra time (albeit only a second or less) to get out of the way as the horse will need to get his weight off the leg being treated before he can lift it. The person holding the other foot up will feel this coming as the horse tries to take his lifted foot back. Keep your feet clear as sometimes the horse will hop sideways on one leg. Personally, I wear steel capped boots any time I'm not intending to ride - have saved my tootsies countless times.

Once, while a vet was dressing a fence injury for Blue Flame, he had me stand next to the opposite HQ and lean on the horse so as to weight the leg that the vet was treating - injury was a large flap on the front of the hock so it couldn't be bandaged with the hock flexed anyway.

Alternatively you could try treating the leg from the opposite side of the horse, as for picking feet above, to take yourself out of the direct line of fire.

Great stuff people - keep 'em coming.

Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:26 pm Post subject:

Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:42 pm Post subject:

Pyrgirl, I can just picture that happening and it brings something else to mind. . .

Never let horses interact over wire fences

Blue Flame once tried to double barrel some younger horses through a 7 wire fence and got a hind leg caught through it. Even if he had all the training in the world, he could not have stood and waited to be rescued or he would be dead - because that fence was hot - really hot. The reason it was hot was to teach the horses to respect the fences. This is when he tore open the front of his hock in my earlier post and he snapped a 4" round post off getting himself free. As it was, we found him in the morning standing and waiting right next to the post he snapped.

I don't think we could've set things up any differently to prevent this as the tape, bog and ditch seperated the horses from the wire fence with horses over it. The mistake we made was turning out with another herd and assuming they'd all be ok.

The thing I learned from this (actually I already knew but he was staying away from home during a horsemanship camp and was bullied by the resident herd through a hot tape, a bog and over a ditch to even get to this fence) was something I think Tom Dorrance said - "Never let horses interact over wire fences".

Ever since that day, if my horse is in a paddock next to horses in an adjacent paddock with a wire fence seperating them, I will run a tape along the fenceline to stand them off the wire.

Pocket Knife

I've been a bit slack lately but I try to always keep a pocket knife on me when around horses - never know when you might need to cut a rope or similar.

As soon as I happen upon a pocket knife with the capability to cut wire included, I'll buy it.

Leah · Member Joined: 02 Feb 2009 Posts: 1476

The pocket knife is a BIG one ESPECIALLY when using rope halters.

I have one and really should keep it on me!

Autumn · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:00 pm Post subject:

I have a horse trailer that has tack pegs in the tack room. Once when Rooster was inside, he got his head over the top and caught his rope halter on one of these pegs. luckly, he did not panic, just stood there calmly. I went to check on him and found him there, no knife, and I had a bugger of a time getting him loose. (I started to panic) It makes me wonder if I should use a different halter for trailering, or I was thinking of adding plexiglass to make the top taller.
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Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:04 pm Post subject:

If a horse is moving around it could be quite risky trying to get a knife close enough to them to free them.

There are special rescue knives that can be bought that are designed for cutting seatbelts off people. They're designed to minimise the risk of causing further injury to the person. These knives are basically a hook shape which is blunt on the outside of the hook and the cutting is done on the inside of the hook thus lesseining the chances of cutting the horse or person when freeing them of ropes or seatbelts. You'd need to make sure the rescue knife has an open enough hook to accept the rope you want to cut.

Here's some example rescue knives - many more options if you google:

A plain fold out rescue knife:

A multi purpose knife with a rescue knife blade - the hooked one on the right:

Blue Flame · Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:30 pm Post subject:

Gates

By far the most dangerous gates are the ones that open towards you and swing themselves shut. If you're not paying attention - say busy driving other horses away from the gate, they will swing shut just as your horse is coming through. I had this happen 2 weeks ago and poor Blue Flame got 3 legs through the gateway but the last one had to go over the top. He suffered some loss of fur and bruising around the hind knee that scraped over the top of the gate.

Again, not something I didn't know but I opened the gate and stepped partway through to drive the other horses away from the opening. Blue Flame followed me in just as the gate was swinging shut. I beat myself up about that for quite awhile.

Even if a gate doesn't swing shut on it's own, a horse can catch the end of it with hip or hind and pull it shut on himself. Remembering is more natural for them to go forward than backward in such a situation and you can see how the horse would try to rush through and end up clamping himself into the gateway. Additionally, any gate can swing shut if it's windy enough.

Gates that open away from you are far less dangerous as if the horse makes contact it will swing open and not create a closing trap.

So, if on the ground and passing through gates, I try to make a habit of keeping myself between the gate and the horse as I send or lead him through.

If the gate has the option of opening both ways, then open it away from you. If riding and you do not have this option or a way to maintain control of the gate at all times, I'd be tempted to dismount.

Oh, and watch those stirrups don't catch as the horse goes through.