It's About The Horse

xenophon · Posted: Tue May 18, 2010 5:56 am Post subject: My Two Cents

I have been trimming my five horses for about 2 years now. I started with zero experience but tried to absorb all of the info that I could. Four years of shoes (summer only) had caused the heels to become under run and the toes to stretch out in front of the frog for the length of the frog. I have heard this referred to as being clown footed. These conditions were found on the front feet only. The hind feet were never in that bad of shape, which I have found to be typical with most horses whose feet I have examined. It could be that my farrier was not doing the job correctly on the front, but for reasons I won't go into, I decided to try barefoot trimming. My farrier politely declined to learn about barefoot trimming, so we amicably parted ways.

It has been said that it takes a full year to grow out a new hoof. The experience with my horses is that it can be months less than that. Nevertheless, one new hoof was not enough time for a transition to fully go barefoot (meaning no boots) with some of my horses. Perhaps if a more experienced trimmer had started with my horses that transition time would have been reduced, but I am so pleased at how my herd's feet doing right now.

On Saturday I went on a ten mile ride, walking trotting and cantering equally on varied terrain that I would not have thought about doing last year at this time with out boots or shoes. My horse never gimped once! At the end of the ride there was not one chip out of his hoof walls. It had been about three weeks since I last trimmed him and I elected to not touch him up before the ride wondering how much a hoof would wear after such a ride. I can't say I saw any wear at all.

What I have learned over the past two years:
1.Don't make the heels sore. I leave the heels slightly (only slightly) longer than the quarters and the toes as viewed from the bottom.

2. If you cut out the bar extension and your horse gets sore or if it grows back right away, don't cut it out again. It needs that.

3. Don't fret too much about quarter flairs. They need to be addressed by sharply beveling along the hoof wall there, rather than rasping them off and perhaps thinning the hoof wall too much. I believe a thin hoof wall at the quarters encourages the flair to continue.

4. If you think that, looking from the top, the toes look too long, they probably are. The distance from the inner edge of the toe wall to the point of the frog should be about 1/3 the length of the frog. Failing to recognize this, or at least act on it out of fear of doing harm, I think lengthened the transition time for my horses. I finally had some x-rays done and could see that I needed to take the toes WAY back. After doing this the feet started improving rapidly along with the soundness of my horses on any terrain.

5. If you think you may need to apply a steeper "mustang roll" at the toes, you probably do.

6. Unless thrush is present, leave the frogs alone!

7. Diet, diet diet. If you have a series of radial rings on your hoof walls there is probably a problem with the diet. Too many carbs, not enough minerals, hard to day. But diet is probably the culprit and each one of these rings, that formed at the coronet band, are weak spots in the hoof wall. And if the hoof wall has week spots I'm willing to guess that the sole does too, contributing to tenderness on gravel surfaces. Also, an obese horse (and there are a lot of them out there whose owners don't recognize as such) will have difficulty being a sound barefoot horse, not to mention the risk of founder. Diet, diet, diet!

8. If your horse spends most of their time in a small stall moving little, all of the above may be moot and the horse may need to always have boots on anywhere but the stall or a sandy arena. A horse needs to move to keep their feet healthy. If you have at least a medium sized paddock look into the book called "Paddock Paradise." I don't buy all of what the author has to say, but most of it is good stuff and will help your horse keep moving throughout the day if you put into practice the basic premise of the book. A horse's hoof will become accustomed to the environment in which they are kept. The softer the environment, the softer the feet.

9. If the sole is flat with little or no depth to the collateral groove at the point of the frog, bevel the heel on the same plain as the bottom of the collateral groove. If you think you have taken off too much heel, you probably have. Learn from it, especially if the horse is more sore after the trim than before. The same applies to heels that are obviously too long but the live sole plain will not allow you to take them down very much.

10. Which brings me to the sole. Never cut out live sole to make the foot meet a particular angle criteria. Never. In fact, just leave the live sole alone.

That is my experience and ideas in a nutshell. I am interested in what schooled barefoot trimmers have to say. I offer these ideas hoping they might help those that are struggling trying to get their barefoot horse sound without relying on boots in all but the most extreme circumstances. These ideas have worked with my horses.

Jim

Newfman · Member Joined: 03 Feb 2009 Posts: 510 Location: Maine

Looks like you have learned a lot. Those are certainly good things and will serve you and your horses well.

A couple small points, if you don't mind the opinion of a wind bag. . .

xenophon · Posted: Tue May 18, 2010 7:30 pm Post subject:

THANK YOU, Dennis! I was hoping someone would comment. I will print it out and review it often.
Jim

Newfman · Member Joined: 03 Feb 2009 Posts: 510 Location: Maine

Can't leave a fellow Northern Idahoan hangin. . .

Glad I could help.
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The above is my opinion, due diligence is your responsibility. Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level, and beat you with their experience.

whudson · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 1:02 pm Post subject:

I really enjoyed both your posts

I trim my horse as well but am cerainly at a beginner level. Had a hoof practitioner (from Vermont) visit last weekend and she felt I have done a great job over the winter and noticed some positive changes since she last saw him in October. This felt pretty good to me

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Wanda
Kitt... app/qh cross

Newfman · Member Joined: 03 Feb 2009 Posts: 510 Location: Maine

Sounds like Sue Mellen
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The above is my opinion, due diligence is your responsibility. Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level, and beat you with their experience.

whudson · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 2:33 pm Post subject:

That's who it is...you know her Newfman? Comments..positive or otherwise?

It's interesting but the comments that she made about Kitt's hooves were that the "heavy" mustang roll ( now that we are heading out of "rehabing") should not be as "strong". ( heavy roll brought his toes back nicely) How do I explain this.....By putting on a real heavy mustang roll, I was taking away most of the hoof wall, all three parts of it and causing him to use the sole as primary weight bearer as opposed to the two inner walls. Now I'm to take the roll back to include the outer wall but not the water and white line. Just to take the weight bearing off the "outer" wall and take it from the "sole" as well thereby helping him to concave....which has begun to happen nicely

Does that make sense? I don't have all the lingo down I'm sure but I think that is the jest of it

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Wanda
Kitt... app/qh cross

Newfman · Member Joined: 03 Feb 2009 Posts: 510 Location: Maine

I don't know her personally, but she was brought in to second seat a case with a Halflinger here in town that a fellow trimmer was working on. Long story short, Sue has since taken over. The other trimmer had been shackled by the horses owner, and was not allowed to treat the situation as aggresively as needed. Sue showed up, had more confidence and an AHA certification and the owner became more reasonable in allowing the horse to be treated as necessary. Sue will be the 6th hoof care provider to get involved, that I know of. Funny, the owner had a tendancy to dismiss me at every turn, yet Sue and I seem to have most of the same pilosophies and methods, as far as I have been able to gather. I wish her great success, and it will be interesting to see how long it takes for her to get fired.

I think you are fortunate to have her assist you. If you are at the point that you are just beveling and rolling up to the waterline and leaving about a 1/16" (sorry 2mm) of hoof wall proud of the sole, you have done incredibly well. Very good on you indeed.

We keep saying that we need to go to Newfoundland someday. We are Newfoundland dog lovers.

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The above is my opinion, due diligence is your responsibility. Never argue with a stupid person. They'll just drag you down to their level, and beat you with their experience.

whudson · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 3:57 pm Post subject:

That's great Newfman. Actually, things she says seem very similar to what I have heard you talk about and yes I do feel fortunate that somebody is bringing her in for consult here. Once our mud dissipates some and I get some pics, I will post.

Newfoundland dogs are very nice animals. ( hoping you have the non drooly kind

You should come to Newfoundland. It's a very nice place. Some people come and stay

Could use some knowledgeable hoof people here.

If you do come here, be sure to let me know, I can set up some trims for you. Probably enough to pay for your trip

I paid Sue $75 for trim/consult.

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Wanda
Kitt... app/qh cross

spurrit · Member Joined: 27 Nov 2011 Posts: 17 Location: Kansas

The long toe, low heel situation isn't because of the shoes, it is because of HOW they were trimmed. Even the barefoot hippies have trouble with that, at times, so they just butcher the toe.
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Pet the horse, smack the owner.