consistency

jackspark · consistency

I'd be a lot better off if I would just go with my gut instead of thinking through everything.

Rode my green mare for the first time since the wreck. Made some (I thought) good decisions as to how best to re-introduce her to the idea that we can get out there without an accident.

Gonna ride in a halter
Gonna do a little more ground work
Gonna stay in the acre of dry-lot
Gonna NOT use the mounting block that broke my ribs

Believe me, I had very well thought out reasoning for making these decisions and they were ALL for her benefit and not mine...wanna hear'em? No, I didn't think so, cause you already know that I should have kept all, that she counts on, the same

Poor thing, she couldn't understand why we were doing so much ground work and not going out where it's interesting. She was PISSED! I
stopped and decided to get on and get out. She didn't understand why I was pullin on her to get up, PISSED again! I got the gate open and out we went, she was HAPPY! I decided to work her in the yard and she seemed heavy and I chalked it up to rusty. More work, and a little less heavy but PISSED once again! Duh you moron, I thought. She doesn't recognize the signals and is confused...... used to a snaffle. bandhead

I moved her around the yard going from one grazing spot to another but she acted like that was a pain and she balled up on me, PISSED again I guessed.

Finally I got the message and went back to business as usual and she lightened up and moved out, just as usual. She started to blow and make quite a bit of noise....... tellin me "YOU finally get it, now lets go get some good grass down the road and why were you bein sooooo weird?"

Moral of the story: KISS

cheerios · Re: consistency

Sounds like she was trying to tell you things, but sounds like you were listening.

jackspark

I started her in a side pull and went quickly to a snaffle. Soooooo she never really rode in a halter. Can't believe I did that yesterday, just thinkin I'd go light I guess and I sold my sidepull.

PasoBaby_CarolU

Good lesson Nancy.

I do see this all the time, people showing up at clinics or trail rides with different saddles and bridles or bits from what they usually ride in. All kinds of confusion and no idea what is causing it.

Young horses especially need consistency and then the introduction of new things or changed things slowly, one at a time.

I agree with Mary. A young horse needs a lateral tool until they know legs, weight, and focus. That can be either a jaquima, sidepull or snaffle.

Good choice to ride in a small space. I ride in my round coral (which is really a small arena, 60' x 110'), then pasture, then a friend's full size arena, then controlled trail rides with good horsemen friends only. I don't graduate to large group rides until the horse is ready and we go with seasoned horses they already know along the ride too. We all do this for each other too, so have brought along over a dozen young horses over the past few years. Hopefully there are other good horsemen near you to ride with.

jackspark

I was very hesitant because I wasn't certain how much of the accident was stored in her memory. What would she associate, would she flash back, never had a mounted wreck like that before so I was being ultra conservative. I even wondered that as I picked up the right side of the reins would she remember the last time I did that and how she flipped over?

I guess she discounted it as an accident cause she didn't seem to have been adversely affected by it.

I love her

merle · Re: consistency

Clarissa

Getting brace has nothing to do with the appliance used & everything to do with the human giving the signals!

In most photos & videos I see the rider has the halter set incorrectly on the horse’s head, or the reins tied too loosely, or they are using incorrect body dynamics & mechanics, or using wrong rein aids. Same would go for snaffle or any bit or bridle for that matter that 'wasn't working'.

The halter is designed to teach the rider to give correct aids & use correct biomechanics. Once the rider is doing it right the horse will respond correctly & effectively. I would say the hater is less forgiving than the snaffle. It forces the rider to get correct otherwise the horse will not respond how it is expected to.

Don’t blame the horse or the tools. It’s purely a human thing. Not being prepared to be honest enough to get yourself up to the standard the horse requires for effective communication is just cheating the horse.

Pat shows all the necessary skills in his early levels packs. He even shows a lot of those things still in more recent dvds I've seen. He talks about how the halter should sit on the horse’s head, why certain rein positions are so important & why levels 1-3 are about the human learning how to get up to the level of the horse & why the horse won’t respond positively & accurately until the human can give the correct aids & signals.

Things the rider does that confuses the horse with incorrect signals include but are not restricted to:- halter set too high on the nose & too loosely or wrong size halter on the horse, reins too long, too much slack under the horse’s chin allowing the halter to slop around before any effective communication can be felt or confusing the signals so much the horse has to guess, incorrect rein positions such as crossing the neck, direct rein lower than supporting rein, using both reins as active reins simultaneously, pulling as opposed to directing or holding, using phases of the halter that are too high & not working at lowering the phases to soften the feel, not releasing in a timely fashion, not providing proper body focus, not going through the phases of eyes shoulders belly button hips legs tools, not sitting correctly allowing rider to collapse their ribs on the directing side, not turning the toe out on the directing side, sitting leaning forward. I could go on…. Then of course there are things like bad saddle fit which in itself causes the horse to respond incorrectly as it tries to evade the pain of the fit.

Why is it that Karen Rohlf can cause her horse to respond correctly, effectively & so softly when she rides in a halter? To my mind we really need to lift our game & improve our skills up to those of the horse so it can read our signals & give correct responses. That means we would also be able to ride our horse in a halter just as softly as KR. That’s what the horse demands if we are not to cheat the horse.

JMHO

PasoBaby_CarolU

I have to agree that the rope halter is a poor training tool for young horses. It is fine to put one on a horse that knows most of what you are doing and you're reteaching it to be softer and respond to light pressure, but to a young horse just learning lateral communication it is not clear. If you attach your reins to the chin knots like they would be on a sidepull or snaffle, you'd get better communication, but why not just use a tool designed for lateral training?

I think it depends what you are trying to accomplish. If you are trying to get an older horse soft and responsive on loose reins, then it is a good tool. If you are training a young horse, then you'd be best with a tool for that purpose.

Remember Karen Rohlf's horse also was previously trained in a bit. So the cues, refinement, collection, etc. that she has, were all originally taught on a snaffle.

Notice in Buck's colt starting videos, his initial rides are done in a rope halter, but other then flexing for mounting or flexing to stop for dismounting, he never uses it on the horse's head at all. All lateral work at this point he does with his lariat as a driving role. He then puts on a snaffle to start lateral training.

I do something very similar, but just start in a jaquima and ride in that for most of the horse's first few years. Of course, I'm not in a huge hurry, and could move on to a shanked bit after a year, but I don't need that tool for collection.

I have an ex-show mare here who gaits her mind out the second you climb on her with a bit in her mouth. But I can/do ride her calmly with a rope halter and get nice walks, bends, and relaxation. Her nose hasn't been ruined.

becdubie

Nancy,
Consistency was the biggest thing I learned this summer too. I've started to be more methodical with bubba whereas before we just sort of lumbered around and did something different all the time. I was stuck in the horsenality thought of mind thinking that he is LBI/E...so I better make sure things are interesting for him.

I switched from the halter to DR cooks...now he understands what I want, it was suggestd to stay with one set of tools for about 100 rides for a young or restarted horse...so that's what I'm doing. Working through building blocks. Now that we have good movement and directional control at a walk, I'll be bumping up what we have previously worked on to a trot.

Clarissa say's this:

merle

PasoBaby_CarolU

With the rope hackamore, the reins tie on the halter at the same place, so the cue comes from the same place. The pressure applied to the nose opposite from each rein is only slightly distinct. Put your rope halter on your horse and your hand under the knots and then pull where your reins attach and left and right and you'll notice that the pressure is different left to right, but not particularly distinct. A lot of horses get confused with this and initially back up. The western bosal is not a lot different in this regard as the rope hackamore.

With a snaffle or sidepull or jaquima (a traditional jaquima has a curb strap with rein rings on each side), the reins are attached on each side. So if you pull the left rein, the right side tightens against the nose or mouth, the horse moves it's head to the left and finds release. They are distinct cues, the release is (supposed to be) instant. The left rein is clearly different then the right.

For young horses especially, it is important to be as clear as possible about what you are asking the horse to do. Clear, lateral work is the foundation for getting the horse to move off other cues, legs, weight, focus or neck rein.

merle

PasoBaby_CarolU

I had asked that question of Kathleen, and the horse is trained laterally with the snaffle first, then put in a bosal and two-reined. There is an article or video (??) on Eclectic Horsemen that describes the two-rein technique.

This is what the curb looks like on a traditional Spanish jaquima.

Chablis

consistency

Re: consistency

Re: consistency