| Archive for It's About The Horse The Free Forum for those Doing Parelli - and a whole lot More! "Anything forced and misunderstood can never be beautiful." Xenophon (430-355 B.C.), |
| oldmac_donald |
FeedXL program is free for a dayDear Mel,Today we released our first major upgrade of FeedXL. Along with hundreds of small fixes and adjustments we have focused on 2 main areas: pastures and performance. The new updated FeedXL supports more complex mixtures of pasture types by adding a new "advanced pasture builder" which allows you to use our basic pasture data to define a mix that more closely matches your own pastures. We can even put your own pasture analysis data into FeedXL and our pasture intake estimation will work on it too. FeedXL is also faster. Our server can now analyse your diets in a tiny fraction of a second and we've also implemented improvements which will allow your browser to work a little faster too. When you use a fast web browser such as Mozilla's Firefox, Apple's Safari or Google's Chrome, you can balance diets quicker than ever before. To celebrate this update, we have a special offer for new and renewing Australian users. For 2 weeks only you can use the coupon code NFHYWJ to receive up to $25 off any subscription. This offer is valid for a single use per person and is available until midnight on the 10th of June 2009. It cannot be used in conjunction with any other discount offer. Tell your friends, announce it on forums, whatever you like. Since this discount can even be used on the 1-Day Pleasure plan, making it completely free, it's a great opportunity for anyone you know who has been hesitant to give FeedXL a try. Thanks for using FeedXL! The FeedXL Team—Nerida, Susan & Rod |
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| Leah |
What is Feed XL? | ||
| Clarissa |
It's a computer program run on an excel platform & opperated via the web. It has every known type of feed that is sold in any given country in it's programming plus all the various types of pasture in that country. The makers are extending the number of countries it can run in as they gain more info on individual countries. You type in what you feed your horse by quantity & brand, what sort of horse you have, it's size & work load, what type of pasture it's on & a hundred other parameters as well. It then comes up with exactly what you are feeding your horse in terms of the minerals & vitamins, energy, fibre, etc & whether it is right or enough for that particular horse & it's situation, whether it is balanced, etc. It also tells you what your horse should be getting. I think it can also recommend appropritate feed recipes. I think if a person was fully organised, they could input all their horses' data & get the best results within a one day subscription. The results can be printed out or saved in a file. I think it's a very good idea, having experienced it first hand for free last year. It toldme what I should feed my horses. What it doesn't do is put enough money in your wallet to actually pay for that feed.  
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| appellativo |
I did the trial version and helped submit a few products they didn't have yet. It is a really big help to get a general idea of whether your horse's diet is adequate in several areas. I was able to determine that my horse probably did not get enough vitamin E...everything else she appears to be fine on. I was pretty impressed with the feedxl, personally. I love the way it spells it out for you, and also graphs everything, and tells you too much of this, not enough of that, how much more they need, etc. | ||
| Blue Flame |
So I'm thinking about subscribing to FeedXL and would like opinions from those of you balancing supplements to forage (Dr. E.K. students?) which type of plan to go with.
The standard diet analysis will balance: energy (calories) protein major macro-minerals trace-minerals vitamins A and E It also makes sure your horse is receiving enough forage and helps you to determine if your horse needs any hard feed. The comprehensive diet analysis will balance: Energy (calories) Protein and lysine Macrominerals Traceminerals Electrolytes Antioxidants Vitamins A and E B group vitamins It also makes sure your horse is receiving enough forage and helps you to determine if your horse needs any hard feed. The comprehensive analysis is twice the cost of the standard one but it's not really a big issue for me over a year subscription. I don't want to waste my money, but on the other hand I don't want to short change myself out of the extra information if it's important. Opinions, please? |
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| appellativo |
it depends on what your needs are. if you have a horse with current health issues, or he is in hard work or competition with lots of demands on him, I'd definitely go with the comprehensive. I personally feel, that since my horse is pretty much healthy already, no severe problems, the standard is enough. | ||
| new2thejourney |
Thanks to Old Mac - Mel....I found FeedXL very helpful - AND FREE!! I like the fact that you put in what you are currently doing and they offer so many ways for you to interpret what you are doing right and what could be done more effectively.
Thanks Mel! Karen. |
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| Blue Flame |
The thing is that he is overweight (I estimate a body score of 7 - 8 ) and he over-eats the pasture so I'm wondering if it's possible he is lacking just one thing and he is overeating in an effort to get enough of the one thing. Doesn't help with the run of sunny days and sub zero nights we're having making the grass extra sweet. I do like him on the heavy side during winter as he is uncovered year round - but not this heavy. We use a shotgun approach to his diet supplements, but really no reason to with all these cool tools to help do it smarter. Anecdotally have heard of pastures around here lacking selenium. I suspect copper might be lacking also (or iron excess) due to black coat bleaching out to mahogony and maybe sulphur. Added to that, the managers of our grazing saw fit to fertilise with a seaweed extract (that a newish company offered for free to promote themselves) so would be looking for iodine levels to be checked as well. I think I'll get the comprehensive first time up. There is one of the recommended laboratories in our city (Hill Laboratories - lucky as there are only two in the country) so it will be easier getting pasture analysis. Great to hear from people first hand that have experience with the program - thanks. |
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| Leah |
I just signed on to FeedXl and have been playing around with it a bit.
I have emailed my pasture analysis in-FANTASTIC option!!! I also sent in some missing feeds that I use. I must say-I am really digging this program! Great great program. I can't WAIT to balance it to my pasture-I think I will be saving a good bit of money!! Really several thumbs up. |
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| Blue Flame |
They're still building the database for New Zealand so not so many pasture options at the moment - must get the pasture analysis done. They have about 500 odd feeds/supplements loaded for NZ but the a couple I'm currently using have incomplete information.
Leah, just for kicks, if you load in a disease susceptibility for the horse it will make all the unsuitable feeds in the diet builder turn red and will issue a warning if you add them to the diet. I loaded laminitis to see what would happen and wouldn't you know it - about 80-90% of the feed options turned red (basically anything with grain in it or with incomplete analysis data), including one that I'm currently using which is rice bran based. Worth having a look in the members forum too . . . . |
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| Leah |
I DID that for Polo! 
I was like OOPs wow oh crud! LOLOLOL. I really enjoyed the 'feedback' with the generic pastures-but the minerals were WAY different than when I did my pastures (balancing with paper and calculator)....so I really am so excited to see it with my pastures. If it goes well I am going to do seasonal pasture testing and just plug in the numbers, adjust diet for the season and reassess. I realize pastures will change with weather and wear but I think this would be as close to a perfect program without daily obsessing. |
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| karmikacres |
Jeez, what fun would that be 
Mike |
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| Leah |
WOWOWOWOW
I have sent in 4 feed requests this evening and they are ALREADY added!!! This is JUST TOO MUCH FUN! WOW. Totally obsessed and thrilled with customer service! |
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| Leah |
ALL of my feed requests have now been added!!!
Only my pasture remains-I am sure that takes a little longer. I will report back to everyone when i get my pasture entered. I am already going to be able to drop some supplements and make some changes that will save$$$$$$ Woohoo! |
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| Blue Flame |
I went into Hill's Laboratories today to pick up a sample kit and get a little advice on how to get a good sample and what tests to get done. I thought it'd just be a case of paying for a sample kit and getting an information sheet sheet from the receptionist.
Next thing I know I'm sitting in a specialists office and we go over all the details of what I wanted to achieve - logged onto FeedXL on his computer to show him what results it comes up with so we'd know which tests we need. I must've used up at least a half hour of his time. It turned out that with the testing package I'll need, a dietary anaylsis very similar to FeedXL's is included free of charge - so will be interesting to compare the two. So then as I'm leaving with my kit, reams of additional information and a brand new pair of purpose built sampling shears, I tried to pay for them. They said don't worry about that yet, we'll invoice you after you have your results. I was really impressed with their customer service. I'm hoping to be able to drop some supplements as well. Looking like I'll be able to drop the magnesium supp. but will wait until pasture analysis is in. Will probably continue with the mycosorb with all the rye grass we have plus it's bulked up with yeast and I think I'll be needing to supp vit. E. Leah, sounds like you've got a new toy
EDIT TO ADD: Specialist noticedFeedXL report indicating DE (digestable energy) and launched into the differences between that and what they test for - ME (metabolisable energy). The explanation sounded really good as I listened to it sailing way above my head
BTW, the tests I'm getting done include a few other things they consider important that FeedXL doesn't account for - I think it was Boron, Molybdenum and a ratio between Cobalt, Boron and Molybdenum. Here's a little anecdote for y'all. I've just read the autobiography of local studmaster, Sir Patrick Hogan - considered the best breeder of racing thorobreds in the world. He there were two things his father taught him that account for a large part of his success - the first thing was about placing twice as much importance on the conformation of the front of the horse as on the back - the second thing was that if you do only this - feed your horses better than everyone else - you'll be ahead of 90% of your competition. |
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| Foxtrotalot |
You can still sign up for the beta version for free. I did it just 2 days ago! Great program! | ||
| calatar |
Very cool! | ||
| Blue Flame |
Got my analysis loaded and showing a few holes and excesses.
Calcium is at 99.9% but since phosphorous is at 157%, it's throwing the Ca/P balance out. I think the paddock might have had a dose of superphosphate a couple of years ago when it probably should've been lime. Energy and protein were high which surprised me as sample was taken in dead of winter. Lysine 242%, iron 585%, manganese 394%, chloride 210%, potassium 545%, vit. B2 245% and vit. B5 309% but still green according to FeedXL. On the low side were copper 40%, zinc 85%, selenium 13%  , sodium 47%, vit.A 66%, vit. E 44%, vit. B1 25%, folic acid 54%.
Now the hard task begins of finding supplements to make up the shortfalls without increasing the excesses. Also, another dietary mineral balance was done as part of my pasture testing by the laboratory showing some things FeedXL doesn't calculate like molydenum (ok) and cobalt (low). It also showed a high potassium/sodium ratio and a high staggers index. Ca/P ratio agreed with FeedXL. They also tested nitrogen levels. The lab also said calcium was low although FeedXL said it was ok. Lab list calcium RDI at 79g versus 29g by FeedXL. Using the lab recommendation it would help put the Ca/P ratio up over 2 (Phosporous came in at 157% per FeedXL). I'm wondering if the lab analysis take the phosporous level into account and chooses the highest of RDI or Ca/P requirements for recommended calcium intake. Anyway, the first thing I can remove from the diet is the magnesium supplement I've been using. Highest priority will be to adjust the selenium level. I feed a mycosorb toxing binder year round for staggers prevention and it comes in a vit. B or yeast base so hopefully that'll take care of the vit.B1 and folic acid requirements. For the vit. A and vit.E, FeedXL says they come from green forage and . . . ummm . . . the pasture is green so a bit suspicious of those results. Unfortunately the lab dietary analysis doesn't cover the vitamins so can't compare. Mostly both sets of results agree allowing for differiences in there RDI references. If anyone does find an easy way to convert between iu and grams please let me know. |
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| calatar |
Regarding the folic acid, FeedXL says: "Dietary requirement: Not well defined, appears to be around 20 mg/day for horses in work with no access to green pasture" so I am not going to worry about it too much since my guys are on pasture. You shouldn't have to use too many supplements. Vit E and Selenium is pretty common and there are a lot of manufacturers (so far Seminole is the least expensive one I have found). Regarding the copper and zinc, a lot of hoof supplements have those two minerals in addition to biotin (I am considering SmartPak's brand). Sodium is an easy fix, just add some salt. | ||
| Blue Flame |
Calatar, thanks for the tips  It all sounds so much easier when you describe it that way. Must go look at hoof supplements and selenium supplements.
I'll be passing my lab results on to the facility management with two suggestions - lime yes - phosphate no. NOW, in all of the various places I've read about balancing diets one thing appears to not even get mentioned - water. Our troughs are fed from a town supply so probably some sort of chlorine based biocide in them and flouride (yuck!). Maybe sodium etc. I'd imagine people on bore water would have significant minerals in theor water as well. How many people test what is in the water the horses drink? How much water does a horse drink? Is it significant enough to upset a dietary balance? Does anyone take water into account or have I just missed that part of the discussions I've read? |
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| calatar |
You know that is a very good point. I am not sure about getting water analyzed but I am sure in some situations it would be relevant. Last year the reservoirs got really low because we had been a long term drought. As a result I am sure the minerals levels in the water were different and Cindy Sullivan remarked on how horrible all of her client's feet were doing. | ||
| PasoBaby_CarolU |
Well, I went on and balanced my diets. The only complaint was that it estimated that my horses ate 7.5 lbs a day from 4 hours access to a poor pasture. I wish!
Anyway, I couldn't change it. It also didn't have chromium listed, which I have Bien on. I found out I'm over feeding copper. It also said I'm not feeding enough, even though all mine are easy keepers and maintain weight at what I'm feeding. (said Zar should would loose weight...good, she's on a diet to loose weight) I'm glad it was free though. I wouldn't mind paying $20 for one day access each year to check all my horse's diets. But, I wouldn't want to pay $20/month. Once the diet is set, I keep them on it until next year's hay unless I see something change. |
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| calatar |
Yeah I do wish they would let you adjust the estimated pasture intake on the generic pasture, and I'll prob send them a request for that and see what they say. They are very helpful and have been quick to respond. The good news is that if you get your own pasture analysis done you can adjust the pasture intake. | ||
| PasoBaby_CarolU |
Alayna, if you have your hay analyzed, is there a place to put those figures in?
Has anyone bumped this program against the (very complicated) worksheet of Dr. Ellanor's? It showed my selenium levels OK, this site says I am low. I'm not sure how it knows when there is no hay analysis or choice for alfalfa/grass mix. |
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| calatar |
You can have both pasture and hay analysis done. Just email them the results and they will input it for you. The site is just going by generic measures and if there isn't a particular feed type, let them know and they will add it very quickly. I believe Dr.Kellon is based on the NRC and FeedXL bases their requirements on more recent research (see the NRC vs FeedXL thread).
"The *best* pasture information is your own analysis. We recommend Equi-Analytical Laboratories. We will be adding a function to FeedXL that allows you to enter your own pasture analysis details, however in the meantime please find detailed instructions on how to get your pasture analyzed and into FeedXL." |
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| Clarissa |
Where did you find the link to the beta version? I just tried to sign up for the 1 day plan using the coupon number OMD gave us at the beginning of this thread but it said it was out of date. 
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| calatar |
I believe the free beta is only in the US and Canada. I think they started in Australia so it is more established and no longer free there .
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| Clarissa |
bugga!!
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| Blue Flame |
I'm currently consulting with Jenny Patterson - ex PP who has developed her own line of very successful (as in results, not profits) products. Here's her website: http://www.horsemanshipnz.com/ . She has been requested to load her supplement data to FeedXL. After conversing with Nerida, Jenny refused on the basis that FeedXL takes no account of uptake rates of minerals depending on what form they are in. Jenny goes to great trouble to create compounds to maximise uptake by bonding minerals with amino acids and lots of other stuff thats way over my head. So she's reluctant to let FeedXL use her data as it is just not smart enough to differentiate in this way. As such, it increases the risk of an overdose/underdose due to not compensating for the different bioavailability of various compounds. Learning heaps from Jenny at the moment. She's saved heaps of horses around here - many of whom just cannot tolerate the dairy pasture - by researching, identifying and solving the dietary issues of afflicted horses. A personal friend and SC member saved her horse, with Jenny's help, from a constant involuntary headflick problem by getting him completely off grass. Oops, I've probably said too much, but there it is. |
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| calatar |
Well I FINALLY got my pasture sample cut. I send it off tomorrow and will be eagerly awaiting the results .
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| calatar |
Finally got the pasture results (well most of them, still waiting on selenium). Says Digestible Energy is a little low but my guys are having no trouble keeping weight on so I am not too worried about that. Copper (60%), iodine, sodium, and chloride (all 0%) are the main deficiencies. Easily fixed with a little smart hoof and iodized salt.
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| Foxtrotalot |
Is the beta version toast now? I get re-directed, so I guess it is. But, I also keep getting email notices that my payment is overdue. WHAT payment?? |