So where does an Animal Communicator overstep the mark.

Blue Flame · So where does an Animal Communicator overstep the mark.

I have a friend with a horse that has a myriad of health problems - or more accurately, has a myriad of symptoms. This freind is currently so distraught about her horse she is considering euthanizing the horse.

When she told me this, I didn't want to say too much as I was tired having just finished a nightshift - but I did blurt out that maybe she should have her AC do a reading for her.

Long story short, I'm pretty sure I know what is wrong with the horse - a severe electrolyte imbalance - and how to successfully treat it. I gave her the info and put her in contact with the relevent experts on the matter and things were looking quite hopeful for saving this horse.

Then she got the reading back from the AC which said among other things that the horse wanted to be PTS and that the diet changes wouldn't help because he had a brain tumor.

Now this is what upsets me - I believe an AC can feel what it feels like to the horse - but I don't believe that a horse knows that it has a brain tumor any more than I believe it knows it has an electrolyte imbalance. All it knows is how it feels.

So tonight I got another call from my distraught freind who had decided (again) to have the horse PTS.

I do not doubt that the AC can pick up on how the horse feels - but to call it a brain tumor - for me that is just too big a leap from "my head hurts".

It is really frustrating - there have been horses much sicker than this one who have been successfully treated by adjusting and controlling the diet.

Ironically, or synchronistically maybe, a simlilar scenario was playing out today at work. One of the workers collapsed yesterday following a brain bleed and lapsed into a coma. This morning the surgeons were not prepared to operate as it didn't look good and as a result the family were in the process od discussing pulling off life support. Then, this afternoon, I heard that the guy in the coma had shown some signs of recovery such that the surgeons changed their minds and were going to operate to try to stop the bleeding.

Just think, if someone had made a hasty decision this morning, the surgeons would be harvesting his organs instead of trying to save his life this afternoon.

All this stuff happening around me in the last 24 hours - feels like something I am supposed to either learn or do or help with here - hope I don't miss it . . . . . either something seriously wrong is about to be done with this horse, or else I am seriously out of synch with the universe right now.

Must go to bed now - very tired so please excuse any typos.

jackspark

No, horses don't know they have brain tumors. Humans don't diagnose themselves correctly...... why would horses be able to do that? All you can do is offer info to this person; you can't make them listen to you. You did your part now it's their turn.

Blue Flame

Add to this that if this horse is put down because of this, it will be the 2nd chestnut horse in the same paddock over the past 12 months (only having been a total of 5 horses altogether grazing there) to have been put down due to a supposed brain tumor.

I mean . . . c'mon. It almost seems like the words brain tumor are becoming the excuse of choice for putting horses to sleep. When I first heard about the first one to be put down because of this, I asked how they knew - did the horse have a cat scan or MRI or something or did they autopsy afterward to confirm it? Not freakin' likely! But I think that people think that when when they are justifying euthanazing a horse - nothing sounds like a more humane reason for doing so and will be more likely to have other people nodding solemnly in agreement than "brain tumor".

I they're gonna have a horse PTS, they could at least be honest with themselves about the reason why . . .

I'm just not buying into that . . . .

whisperingwindfarms

I have been dabbling in animal communicating since I have been seriously practicing Reiki - the two just seem to be inextricably linked for me. I cannot foresee that I would ever tell someone something like that. I'm wondering if the AC in this particular instance has an agenda . . .

At any rate, as my friend Abe says, "The beast, like all of you, chooses freedom first. And if ever the physical condition becomes less than joyful, the beast -- if left to himself -- will re-emerge into Nonphysical."

merle

ACs can communicate in a variety of ways. Some hear the animal, some hear their guide (as in the ACs guide passing on information about the animal), some see images, some actual see the inner body (heart, vessels, joints...), some know, just simply know and still others feel. Here are some terms for the different methods of communication;

Clairaudient - psychic hearing
Clairvoyance - psychic seeing
Clairsentience - psychic sensing

I do not know about the AC this thread is referring to or the brain tumor. But did want to share about the different forms of communication.

I have heard, clear as day heard words from animals, other times I have just known - did not hear voice in my head, but knew what my dog was telling me and still other times I have felt the communication. BTW my mule has no patience for flies, they FRUSTRATE her to no end. I felt the frustration as if it was my own, I was even stomping my feet!

4theloveofjake

My AC told me exactly where my horses had mild pain and what they needed to relieve it. She def felt that and even revealed some past events that lead to the pain. I don't think any 2 AC are the same or operate/receive info in the same way or that their level of intensity is the same. Your friend should have the horse tested for a tumor if she feels he has a hope of any quality of life. God bless them both !

becdubie

Blue Flame

Is there a test that could confirm a brain tumor?

I know there is one that could confirm what I believe is the root problem - testing for andosterone which is released by the adrenal glands when the horse tries to conserve sodium and secrete potassium. Testing for the mineral imbalance is unreliable because the horse uses stored minerals in muscles and bone to make up the shortfall and the minerals only spike low a few hours before death.

I will support my friend with whatever decision she makes. However, I just want to make sure she makes that decision from a state of knowledge rather than a state of desperation.

I have seen the same symptoms in another horse who is now re-homed with another family who are absolutely delighted with him.

She is on an emotional roller coaster right now. She'll make a decision to euthanize and feel ok about for a short while, then not ok about it but feeling boxed into it. No-one is pressuring her to do anything except herself. Even her vet said he would support whatever decision she made. I just think she is not in the right place to make this decision yet without a high risk of regretting it further down the track. I think she needs to be more sure.

Last night I told her that she needs to take pressure off herself. First the time pressure - the horse is not all that bad at the moment and his symptoms started a year ago - and wouldn't you know it, they get worse in spring and autumn. Suggested she give herself at least a week as the horse's quality of life atm in my opinion is no worse than that of a horse suffering from sub clinical laminitis. His symptoms only surface when his blood is up from exercise in combination with either bright sunlight or strong wind. I have offered her financial assistance to take that pressure off with no expectation of getting paid back - told her it would be a gift to the horse and I wouldn't take her money anyway.

I made it clear to her that I was not telling her what to do, but that my advice is to give herself at least a week and treat the horse for electrolyte imbalance in the meantime. All that entails is getting him off that damned grass to cut out the excess potassium and nitrates, feeding him hay instead and replenishing his sodium, calcium and magnesium levels. Also, since stress or exercise aggravates his symptoms (as it would with an electrolyte imbalance) thwe other important thing to do is nothing - not ask the horse to do anything else - no brushing, no picking feet, no treating sore muscles etc - just feed him right and leave him be. Its not hard to do. At the very least this would help both horse and owner be in as good a place as they can be if/when the euthanaze.

The other night we offered him loose salt and he was eating it straight out of his owners hand - more interested in that than his feed. I checked the horse yesterday morning and he was alert, relaxed and interested in the world - curious what I was doing and also having a conversation with the goat over the fence. I checked on the horse again at first light this morning and he was just doing what all the other horses were doing - chilling out and grazing - moving normally.

Back to the communicator - I really don't know enough about AC to make a judgement on the accuracy of this particular reading. However, my instincts are telling me it is wrong - like I said, either I'm out of synch with what's going on here or else a good horse is going to be PTS unnecessarily based on an unconfirmed suspicion about what is wrong with him from someone who has never met him in the physical.

Please don't get me wrong, Blue Flame was once a demo horse for Margrit Coates, who met with him in person and that experience convinced me that this AC stuff is real - it is just the level of accuracy and personal interpretation that I am questioning here.

Thanks everyone for your feedback - I'll keep you posted on what happens.

Blue Flame

Blue Flame

One other opinion I expressed to my freind is that IF this horse has severe electrolyte imbalances as I suspect, his pain would be genuine but his thinking/perception of it would be altered due to affected electrochemical processes.

Headaches and migraines are one of the main symptoms of electrolyte imbalances and would probably feel like a brain tumor. However, the sum total of ALL of his symptoms support electrolyte imbalance.

I guess it might depend on what the horse is percieving and projecting, how th AC is picking up on it and what her interpretation of it is. There is alot of scope here for misinterpretation.

jackspark

I don't get it....... what has she got to lose by just treating the horse as you suggest and then if no improvement, do what she wants. Is it expensive, difficult, time consuming? This is not making sense to me.

As to brain tumor, a scan would be the only way I would be sure.

Blue Flame

No it is not expensive to treat, and I've already offered to take care of the cost as a gift to the horse. The largest expense would be feeding him hay and then it's just a matter of some salt, calcium and magnesium. She already has the hay and I've offered to supply all the minerals.

Neither is it time consuming - you feed him once or twice a day as you normally would to get his minerals in him and make sure he has enough hay and water and loose salt. In fact it is less time consuming because you do nothing else with the horse for 8-12 weeks. The most you'd do with him would be undemanding time or sharing territory.

The most difficult part, it seems, is getting him completely off the grass . . . and keeping him off for the next 8-12 weeks.

I really think it is a case of her getting into a tizz over it because she percieves all of his individual symptoms as seperate and insurmountable problems. If it is electrolyte imbalance, then it is likely all of the problems will clear up by treating the one cause since it affects every system in the horse. Then she goes out to the horse feeling bad. Then the horse feels bad because she feels bad and the horse maybe even feels responsible for her feeling bad. Then they get into a vicious circle of feeling bad for eachother. Co-dependent in their misery.

Thats exactly why I'm trying to buy some time for them both - aside from treating the horse's diet - to try to help them break this destructive cycle of sadness and misery they are locked into. The "poor me" drama that she is playing out is literally sucking the life out of her horse. I have to be really careful that I don't do or say anything to enable that drama to continue.

I'm really having to work hard to not get angry at times and still coax things from despair towards action. It's a tricky balance trying to be supportive without playing into and enabling the "poor me" sympathy drama.

In my younger years I'd have just told her to suck it up and get on with it. These days I know that can backfire so I'm trying to be more diplomatic. It will not help her horse one bit if she just sits in the paddock feeling sad. She needs to get on with it - either way - and bring him positive energy.

jackspark

How about her giving the horse to you? Is that feasible?

Blue Flame

So I found out who the AC is. It's Faye Rogers

http://www.animalcommunication-newzealand.com/

Anyone know anything of her?

Blue Flame

Blue Flame

So I had a look around the AC's site and under the information you are asked to supply about your animal is this:

AlythLong

LOL In my opinion there are good/bad : real/imposters : truthful/lying people in all categories. These categories include religious leaders, psychics and annimal communicators!!!!!

Blue Flame

She intends to have the horse put down tomorrow. If she isn't prepared to make the effort, then he is probably better off PTS as he would only get worse without the necessary changes to the management of his diet.

Such a shame - another one of the many. Except in this case it won't be ignorance that killed the horse, but a lack of emotional fitness - and by emotional fitness, I mean she can't or wont push through her emotional fog.

At least the horse will be free of this misery.

whisperingwindfarms

And so if we believe that we are all extension of Source energy and that Source energy (or soul energy if you will) lives forever, then all is well and this animal is making the best decision for himself that can be made. And when he comes back, this lifetime experience will have created a whole new set of desires for him. I can see him becoming a loving and very caring horse owner himself in his next life experience - all because of her.

Peeperpuppy

I don't believe an AC should advise on putting an animal down.

Let me put this in a different perspective. I am a human being who has been in a place of physical pain to the extent that I prayed for death. This was the kind of pain & suffering that has no end & at times you just pass out from exhaustion. It takes its toll on your mental condition & your nerves. There comes a point that you have conversations with God like, "really? Are you kidding? I'm sure I was not on the schedule to wake up today!" I had a moment where I was yelling at Saint Peter to check the list.

Had i been an animal & an AC tapped into me at that point.. someone would have recommended death. I A-1 guarantee it. Dr.'s said I needed to accept that I'd be in a wheelchair & at best, to make the best of it they'd try to manage my pain. I'm one of those people who you can't numb - even when they try to do surgery. So I'm a 3-ring circus for doctors.

I walk with a cane now but I have good days. I never even once got in a wheelchair. If I had to I'd have drug on my elbows into Wal Mart. No chair. I hobbled & it took 4 hours to get 1/4 of the way thru the store but... no chair. I had days that I'd look at wheel chair & say non-flattering things about the chair.

Present day Peeper, 2010 is no longer in that place of pain where I pray for death. Been a long time since I've been there. Not every person or every animal can rebound. There are terminal people, terminal animals but the recommendation of death has to be based of facts & after every effort is made. I had to put down my dog Brownie this year. There was no question of right or wrong. She was dying. I ended her suffering rather than making her body wring out to the end.

MFGM (aka My Fairy GodMother) has since told me, "You were real touch & go there." MFGM is a real person & she knows things thru the animals/human spiritual network. She's scary accurate. But we have a relationship where she will be blunt with me but she's never told me I "should ____" or "the best thing would be to put him down". She always tells me I know in my heart what's right or that I'll know when it's time. I don't think someone else should tell another to euthanize. She's said over & over that she has an opinion on everything but it's not right to impose her opinion or thoughts. And it's ALWAYS up to the individual as to where it all goes.

For me I was just too stubborn to go out like that. For some animals human intervention may stop their suffering without death. In the same token, the person who advises euthanisia is responsible for offering that advice. That's a lot of responsibility

Blue Flame

Whisperingwindfarms and Peeperpuppy,

You have both expressed exactly what is in my mind and heart.

The horse will be ok, one way or another, as long as she makes her decision and doesn't continue to oscillate between fixing him and putting him to sleep - because while she remains undecided she is not implementing the changes needed if he is to recover. This is one reason why I have stopped repeating myself to her - she has the information and needs to make her decision. The other reason I stopped was so as not to play into her "poor me" control drama any further.

I read the letter last night that was sent to the owner from the AC. I'm not prepared to say that she is not genuine, and the letter was in the form of a conversation with the horse where the AC asked questions which the horse answered with messages to the owner direct from the horse. At no stage did the AC advise euthanasia directly since the letter was constructed so that the request for euthanasia came from the horse.

Peeperpuppy, the things expressed by the horse in the letter were pretty much along the lines of your description of your experience - except that the physical pain was a very distant second behind his worry about not being able to think clearly and his fear of hurting someone - the fear he was losing his mind. He blames himself and feels responsible for his owner's suffering. The content of the letter was mostly a drawn out apology and request to be PTS - again, not so much for his own suffering as much as to end his owner's suffering.

Whether the communication was genuine or not, the alleged expressions of the horse were reasonable considering his condition. It was interesting to read between the lines of the letter to find meanings in the choice of wording. It was worded in such a way that it talked all around "brain tumour" without actually saying it - but made it obvious that what was meant. Of course, the letter ended with the disclaimer "This is not veterinary advice".

As I went down to tend to Blue Flame this morning I glanced over at the horse in question - he was quite happily grazing away the way a horse would normally do with no signs of distress. Unfortunately he is grazing the grass that is making him sick. That seems to be the pattern, his symptoms only surface when people get near and try to "do" things with him - probably because he doesn't trust himself not to accidentally hurt them. While he is not too worried about people near his head, he instantly stresses if anyone handles his feet or is near his HQ - the two most likely places where someone could get hurt.

Whisperingwindfarms, if your post means what I think it means, then I agree. What is disappointing is that once the horse is free, he will initially suffer the disappointment in himself of not achieving his objective in this lifetime. I believe that objective has to do with his owner - and that is also the main reason I did not take him when he was offered to me, his purpose is with her, not me.

Blue Flame

Hey, I forgot to mention some good news.

The human workmate I mentioned earlier who had a brain bleed and went into a coma. It seems his brain rebooted Wednesday afternoon and on Thursday morning he opened his eyes and was able to squeeze peoples hands in response to voice requests. The bleeding has stopped and the blood is being reabsorbed. The surgeons have placed him back into a drug induced coma to help further recovery.

It must be remembered that on the Wednesday morning, those same surgeons had pretty much written him off and family was considering turning off life support.

Peeperpuppy

jackspark

Still shakin my head over this one. I have pts my fair share of animals and if I have made mistakes it has always been trying too hard and waiting too long. The bonds are so strong that, for me, letting go when there is still a chance, IS THE problem. How do you pts an animal that is still functioning when there is ONE more thing you could try? Just trying to understand letting your own stress level dictate the end of an animal's life.

coveredbridgefarm

I have to agree with Nancy in that it is unfathomable to me that she would not at least try to give your electrolyte imbalance theory a shot. Maybe this woman is simply looking for pity anywhere she can get it. I hate to cast aspersions upon her but it sounds like she isn't giving the horse a fair chance. I hope this isn't a case of a person engaging in such a high level of self pity that she is willing to sacrifice the horse unnecessarily.

The question of when an AC is going too far is a good one. Since we(or at least I) don't know how much a particular AC knows, it's pretty difficult to know when they have gone too far.

Larry

bit

It's not just this woman with her horse, people use their kids as excuses for attention, muchhousin by proxie, thier addictions, whatever. It's the human with that needs healing, and perhaps the horse simply reflecting the fact. She may have a pretty tough time seeing her pain in his eyes.

Peeperpuppy

Yeah Bit, every since reading about this the first time that has been the general overall feeling I get very strongly. The horse needs something very minor to fix the problem. The human in the equation needs something major... the horse can help but can not do it for her.