Wettest Weather has Affected Jude’s hooves!

Clarissa · Wettest Weather has Affected Jude’s hooves!

Now, based on only that info can you make a prognosis?

That’s how I’m feeling right now.

The signs & symptoms are so vague but I think I have decided what it’s all about. I think this itch she now has is related to her sore hoof.

She broke out in this itch in December I think it was. Never been itchy a minute in her 14yr life, then overnight there it was all over her & because she is how she is, she just doesn’t rub it a bit, no, she’s doing her darndest to rub herself completely raw & in the process breaking all my shrubs & small trees around the garden.

Within days of the itch came a sore RF foot. The first time I saw it, it seemed to be a sprained ankle from bending herself in half to scratch her udder & underbelly with one back leg cocked in the air. Since it was raining a lot then & the ground was very slippery & muddy, I assumed she had slipped while bracing herself against that front foot to scratch under her belly. It seemed to heal, then 2wks later I thought she was limping again, only just very slightly & hard to decide which foot, also palpation didn’t show up any soreness. No heat anywhere either.

So time has gone by & as a result of changing my horses through my 3 paddocks & using various topical preparations on Jude, I have deduced her itch is caused by the overly starchy grass bought on by all the unseasonal rain. Jude is a good doer, which to a lot of people means trouble for some horses prone to sweet starchy grasses, but has never been a problem with Jude previously.

Now her FR hoof is getting very sore. I have been checking it constantly for soreness using the testers but nothing raised it’s head as the cause. She has a minor surface crack down front of that hoof but has had that before a few times which grows out after a while. She has a bit of WLD which I dug out with looped hoof knife & doesn’t seem to go very far in. (to be expected during this extremely wet season) However today she has developed hot heels on that hoof. It could be a mild abscess or it could be laminitis. She has never had foot problems at all before.

It’s a long time since I had a horse with an abscess & I almost forget what the heat pattern feels like. I think I remember that just a small part of the hoof got really hot quite quickly & within a few days it broke out & the other time the vet cut a hole in the sole at the sight of intense heat & the stuff spewed out. But the sole of Jude’s hoof is quite cool, as is most of the wall, but the heels are hot. There is no heat or swellign in any part of her leg, nor is the coronet band hot or sore.

Anyway by tomorrow arvo I think I will see what I need to do….hopefully.

When she is in the front paddock or the house yard her itch heals up well in just a few days, then breaks out again within hours of being put in the back paddock. When in the house yard she breaks all the shrubs because she rubs so hard & has all but decimated the garden. It will grow back no doubt. I haven't noticed if her sore foot also gets a bit better when away from the sweet grass of the back paddock.

So this afternoon I made the heart breaking decision to separate her from the others hoping Sonny & Cassie would remain down the driveway of the houseyard near her. But NO!

They have shot through! Leaving her devastated, crying & bewildered that her herd would abandon her like that.

Jude is the boss & hates them leaving her sight. Also she is swearing at me too! My horses are prone to letting me know in no uncertain terms when I have upset their apple cart!

She has several different whinnies, each meaning something different & she is out there now going through her repertoire, swearing at or beseeching me, then turning away to call the others, then swearing at them when they don’t answer, then getting mad, then galloping with frantic short screams at the same time, then back to the corner looking towards the house & calling to me to understand her dire circumstances again. She cries! I have seen tears running down her face when she has been distressed! None of this is doing her foot any good at all but there is nothing else I can do.

The cries are dying down a bit, now that it’s dark & I just hope she doesn’t damage her foot anymore during the night.

If it's laminitis it should start getting better after a few days in the front paddock on less starchy grass, but if it’s an abscess I hope it gets on with it & shows me where it’s gonna break out so I can open a hole for it & get her out of pain.

I have condies crystals to bathe her foot in once an abscess breaks out if it's that. I think I'll have to get her some brewers yeast to help with the sweet grass. I think I remember right that the yeast helps starch digestion in horses.

PasoBaby_CarolU

Hmmm, Clarissa, I can tell you that before any horse founders the first time, it has never foundered before.

I wouldn't assume that it isn't laminitis. I think you have done right separating her from the rich grass. Two other things that come to mind are stone bruise/abscess that you are looking for, or she may have gotten laminitis in the first episode and now has developed an abscess where the lamina separated from the hoof wall. That is not uncommon.

I've also had horses paw, dig, or kick enough to get their front foot sore.

I'll keep my fingers crossed for her, that all comes out OK. If you try putting a poultice on her foot, if there is an abscess it will speed its opening.

Clarissa

Yesterday 22Feb I had another dig around in Jude’s hoof at the front on the white line & found a small black spot which I excavated. I followed it about ½” up the wall. It seems to be old & perhaps an old stake injury. I’m thinking maybe she stood on something that drove up through the white line when she braced herself with that leg to bend 180degrees to scratch under her belly.

I used the looped hoof knife first then took these photos, then used a thin pointed scalpel to dig more out & get a better look. But it seemed to keep going up just the same narrow black rotted track. I mean it never seemed to widen out like if it was an opening to an abscess. Neither was it moist. I didn’t want to break through the sole-wall connection too much.

After cleaning it out I filled it with a wad of betadine soaked cotton wool. I guess a vet or farrier would open it right up with all that entails regarding aftercare.

23 Feb 2011 Today I checked it but was dejected to find that RF fetlock was badly swollen & she was having trouble bearing weight on it.

This could be the result of her galloping around night before last when I put her alone in front paddock. OR it could be that I inadvertently blocked a draining abscess with the cotton wool wad I stuffed in the hole I made.

So I pulled out that wad, syringed betadine directly as far up into the track as I could get it which wasn’t very far past where I had excavated it to. Then I put a much looser wad of cotton wool in there just to stop mud getting in.

She has mostly settled down now but I have also made the other 2 horses stay nearer to her. She has hardly eaten & is already looking tucked up so I gave her some Rhodes hay left over from last dry season just as a filler. She likes it even though it has hardly any nutritive value anymore but it still smells sweet. That will make her feel more special because right now she is feeling very hard done by!

Chablis

Hey Clarissa, I reckon it's possibly an allergic reaction to a diff. grass species in your paddocks that may not have grown for some time, or possibly rolling on ants nests ('cause they are a dry spot in your paddock). I just wrote about the possible allergic reaction in your other thread.

My mare is going through the same thing, except instead of a sore tootsie, she got greasy heel on all 4 legs.

Definitely keep your mare off the grass and see if you get a vet to help you get the itchines and that hoof under control.

RickB.

Clarissa

Clarissa

There has been a development today.

An abscess let go this morning right there in front of me as I fed Jude her molasses & bute sandwich.

Dark grey/black oozie stuff bubbled up through the hair on her coronet band & trickled down the front of her hoof.

It’s the same hoof where the sole has only partially separated.

I couldn’t smell it at all but the other horses did & Sonny was trying to get at it. Jude stepped away & Sonny started licking the grass where that foot had stood! YUCK!! puke_r

I tried to chase him away but he wouldn’t be put off! They both phlemmed (sp) repeatedly. It’s obviously thrushy stuff from an abscess but it has taken so long to break through.

I think it started to break out way back early this year when I started this thread, then got better to a certain extent, then just recently started up again. A few nights ago Sonny was feeling very fit & started galloping around & the others went too despite me trying to stop them. The next day Jude was really, really sore & needed extra bute to help her be comfortable. Yesterday she was a lot more sorer than previous day & not walking much at all & her pastern was a bit swollen. I thought she had sprained her pastern or fetlock.

Then this morning this abscess has popped out. I’m really happy it’s come out but I truly didn’t think she had an abscess. I thought she probably had bruised sole cushions or a sprain from that galloping around. There was no heat that would indicate problems, just the general discomfort. Also it looks like thrush stuff, not white or pale puss from a normal abscess. I’m reluctant to remove the partially separated sole incase it goes into live tissue. I was hoping that bit of sole would make up it’s own mind about coming off. But it’s still really firmly attached around 2.5 sides & the separation isn’t across the whole sole, just one side.

So now I can’t remember how I should treat it.

It’s 6yrs ago since Sonny got the piece of rusty steel in his hoof & the vet dug a hole in the sole at the site & let the abscess drain out there, packed the hole, bandaged the hoof & all was good after a day or 2.

Should I clean Jude’s hoof & use peroxide first, then spray on some Epson salts in water (what concentration?) & boot her? Or does she need antibiotics in which case I will need to call the vet? Sonny did get AB’s. My elderly vet friend down the road is only a locum these days & can’t prescribe medication if not employed in that capacity. To date he has helped me although I try not to ask because I know he won’t accept payment.

We’ve actually had a few days of dry weather ….. actually the longest dry period this year! There has been 7days without major rain. The first 4 days yielded small light showers during the night only, but dry sunny days, then 3 hot sunny days with drying wind, hence dry grass for horses to stand on for a change. However 3 days rain beginning right now with a doozy of a storm! Holiday is over…sigh

Perhaps the drying of Jude’s hoof pushed the abscess out of dormancy into it’s final stages of rupture. So that must be a good thing hopefully. Also I was hoping these drier days will enable healing processes.

I read the thread Bit wrote about Gunner’s abscess from this time last year which gave me a lot of good info. I also read 3 other threads from last yr about thrush, abscesses, etc. Followed the links contained therein. Lots to think about.

Storm really bad with huge close lightning strikes, hail, driving rain & strong wind. Cassie likes to gallop around when there’s lightning close & Sonny is kicking up but poor Jude just wants to stay still under a tree but feels the need to stay with other 2. I expect her foot will be very sore again tomorrow.

I just checked Jude before as storm arrived & she was walking much better with help of bute 6hrs ago, but abscess has stopped draining.

Regarding nutrition for their feet etc, all horses are now getting a double strength biotin supplement that I was finally able to get when I went to Brisbane over the weekend. For the first 2wks they will get twice the dose in very small morning & evening feeds. That should be enough to see new horn at the heels since the platforms got eaten away right into the heel bulbs on all 3 horses all 4 feet. I have been talking with several other horse people I know & all are experiencing similar thrush/fungal problems. So it is quite widespread in this area. I’m glad I’m not the only one with these problems. It makes me feel better that it can’t be put down to bad management of my horses. Apparently it is similar to a particular type of thrush/fungal infection usually found way down south where winter is their wet season.

Blue Flame

Clarissa

Yes Blue Flame my gut feeling was to leave it because I think this latest abscess flare up was caused by the galloping around & it certainly would have caused bruising of the solar cushion. I’m sure PR’s DVD helped to set my mind at ease regarding what to do about the partly shed sole.

Today Jude is walking the best in a long time. There was an almighty storm day before yesterday in the afternoon then it all fined up & yesterday & today has been brilliant sunshine again. Rain is staying down the coast which is lucky for me.

All horses walking much better & their feet are looking much better too with new treatment regime. This morning they cantered & frolliced up the hill to me for breakfast which was extremely pleasing to witness.

Lady at saddlery yesterday said many horses in this area too lame to walk & steel shoes not helping much either to keep feet out of wet. I’m considering myself lucky that I have got on top of everything in the nick of time mostly due to my knowledge & experience & management, along with a little timely help from my vet neighbour.

Saddlebag

You can soak it in Lysol household cleaner diluted as for regular cleaning. Then apply a mix of polysporin and athletes foot cream. They both come in small tubes. Mix them together well and apply. You will need to do the soak 2 x daily for about 20 min. followed by a new application of the two creams. Do this until you feel you've gotten the thrush. An abcess, if left alone will usually blow out the top of the coronary band, not the heel bulb.

Clarissa

Thanks for that recipe Saddlebag. If they end up with thrush I'll try to source the ingredients. What they have ATM is a bacterial infection which is not thrush apparently. The borax helped to change the PH of their hooves & I only had to do it once.

Their feet are mostly dry the last few days although there has been some rogue showers last 2 days & nights.

Whatever internal infections they have had in their feet have blown out the heel bulbs. I guess it's to do with the bacterial infection that has been eating the horn away in the heel regions from the heel quarters back around to where the frog connects.

Such an interesting bacteria really how it only affects that part of the hoof. Other people are noting the same thing.

Clarissa

Earlier in the month I decided the horses could be let out to go down the back paddock again since it was supposed to be quite dry this month. As it has turned out this month has only had 6 wet days which has been good. I got the horses back up into the front paddock in time for the last lot of rain last weekend which lasted 48hrs. However when I did their feet on the first day I was deflated to see their little holiday to the back of the property had undone all the repair work of the last 2mths!

Where there had been recent new hoof growth at the heels there was again……..nothing! Just a big hole in the heel bulb where the hoof should curve around to join the frog. And if I use too much pressure with the hoof pick on the place where the heel platform shold be it will easily go right through the thin horn & draw blood. All horses were sore but not too lame.

Luckily we have had some very dry cold sunny weather this week so having them back in front paddock has meant a quick turn around in their hooves. They are drying out well & yesterday I scrubbed them clean, dried off & painted a bit of formalin into the crevices, then applied their boots for the day. Today I put on Stockholm tar again since that seemed to be very helpful last time. Can't leave boots on at night because of the amount of moisture in the grass & which settles from heavy fogs making their boots like soaker boots instead of dry boots.

When I took their boots off they had really clean dry hooves with no dirt in the crevices & holes & I wondered what I could use to plug those places that might stay there to keep the dirt out better. It takes me about 1.5hrs to do all 3 sets of hooves which is very hard on my body. Also it would be much better if the dirt was kept out of the injured parts to allow better healing. I was thinking of children's plasticine but wondered what it was made from as to whether it was suitable. I could apply a remedy then plug the gaps with plasticine.

I also heard of using silicon because it will stick in place but still be supple so it doesn't cause more expansion of hoof wall gaps.

I have found the Dr Kohnke's hoof sealer doesn't stay on long enough to dry & therefore be effective. I would have to hold them up on some sort of concrete slab for hours to allow it to dry. Today when I applied the stockholm tar I gave them hay so they didn't walk around for 15mins but even the short lawn grass is still wet underneath so every step causes moisture to squelch up under their feet, thereby washing the tar off again.

PasoBaby_CarolU

I don't think you want to do that Clarissa...at least I wouldn't. Thrush is caused by anaerobic bacteria that thrive in low/no oxygen environments. If you seal the bottom of the foot, you seal out the oxygen. If the foot was sterile when you sealed it that would be one thing, but it isn't.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrush_%28horse%29

I don't think there is a magic answer for you. Maybe a hoof jack and a stool to sit on?

Clarissa

Carol I agree with you about the anaerobic thing, but the idea about the silicon came from a farrier site where it was used to fill gaps after resection & WLD. Anyway I’m not sure what medication to use since it would be a one time application so until I work that out I won’t be filling gaps! lol

Blue Flame

I've found tea tree oil works great for thrush. After picking out the feet, I drip it in, neat, with an eye dropper to the usual nooks and crannies - central sulcus, collateral grooves, whiteline and wall cracks.

PasoBaby_CarolU

Thanks Blue...sounds like something you could do on a regular basis to prevent thrush during soggy times.

Clarissa

I took these photos this afternoon of Jude's front foot showing the extent to which the rot has chewed away at the fresh hoof growth of the last 4wks. It has totally eaten away all that has grown recently & I think it is worse than it was a month ago. It astonds me how it only eats the heels away.

I posted more about what I am using as treatments & the horses wearing boots etc in the thread about Sonny's feet.

Clarissa

Whacko!! We’ve had 4wks of basically dry weather with only 3 moist nights! That’s the driest spell since this time last year!

Early this morning we had a short shower.

My horse’s feet have stopped growing. These 2 photos show Jude’s abscess that broke out in the coronet band back on 3rd May & what it looks like now. It has hardly grown down at all. Also you can still see the top 3rd of the crack I investigated & posted a photo of on 22nd Feb. So in 4mths it has only grown down 1.25” which is not much. This hoof underneath is in reasonable condition other than the one heel platform which is gone.

I didn't trim the RF this time because I wanted to keep weight off that heel because it seems to be repairing. Compare them to shots I took back in late May when the rot got really active again.

These 2 below show her other front which is not doing so well but this is the one with the sloughed sole that won't let go. I'll try to let the walls grow down a bit now even though this hoof has that extra thick sole.

All horse’s feet are looking much better now that they have had a month to dry out & there is not much sign of active rot, even though due to not growing there isn’t a lot of new hoof showing yet. They are all walking well enough although each horse has 4 different feet of differing shapes. Some have 2 heels on each hoof but no heel platform & maybe a heel quarter crack, some have no heels or 1 heel & WLD, or quarter crack & no heels. Most are showing a new tighter angle growing down slowly, Cassie has wavy lines coming but in the larger scheme of things that is not a big issue since Jude’s got that wavy for a while too but are getting better now.

Currently I am trimming their feet every 2wks to unload the walls so allow the new angle to grow in unfettered even though there is hardly anything to remove due to slow growth. I was leaving flares, WLD, folded bars, anything that gave them something to stand on. However now that their feet have dried out & beginning to harden up, I have been conservatively trimming out WLD, folded bars, reshaping heels, platforms & frogs, unloading quarter cracks & flares. For the first 2.5wks of this month all horses had their boots on fulltime. Since the days & nights have been dry, I left the boots on only checking a boot on each horse daily. All boots have remained dry & fresh smelling inside helping their feet even more. The paste has been most helpful in that department I think. I made it out of beeswax, TTO, copper sulfate & borax. The process I used was to scrub the hoof thoroughly with water getting all dirt out of all nooks & crannies & drying it, then applying peroxide, then drying, then ACV & allowing to dry, then the paste plastered all over their soles & pressed it into all nooks & crannies. The boots kept their feet clean & dry while there was no rain or wet foggy nights creating wet grass.

All horses appear to be producing soles that will slough off eventually. Jude’s have been at that point for months but because she needed them for protection of weakened sole I didn’t cut them off.

It’s been a very long haul & most likely some readers of this thread see my methods as way unorthodox which is correct & some have had differing opinions for treatment & management of my horses but they aren’t here doing the hands on. I would love to have had help, still would actually. I have had 3 fully lame horses that in reality should have been stabled in sterile dry conditions but that has not been possible & the weather has been against me all the way for a solid 12mths now causing them to have wet, muddy conditions. But finally I see a light at the end of the tunnel & I hope that if the weather is favourable I should have sound horse’s feet again in another 4-5mths…..just in time for the next wet season!

Clarissa

On 3rd May I posted that an abscess had popped out on Jude’s front foot. Here’s a photo of it today.

See how little growth there has been in the intervening 4mths. Very frustrating when trying to trim out incorrect shape.

becdubie

Wow that's very slow growing. During the summer my horses grow that much out in about 2 months. I can tell this year because Bubba has a Ring showing from when he was sick. So interesting how everything they go through can show up intheir hooves.

They are starting to slow down growin a little now cuz the weather is getting cooler. You're in your winter now aren't you? Will he grow faster when summer comes?